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Agile Coaches' Corner shares practical concepts in an approachable way. It is for agile practitioners and business leaders seeking expert advice on improving the way they work to achieve their desired outcomes. If you have a topic you'd like discussed, email it to, or tweet it with #agilethoughtpodcast.

Jan 24, 2020

This week on the podcast, Dan Neumann is joined by AgileThought colleague and return guest, Eric Landes! Eric Landes comes from a DevOps background and originally started as a developer. Currently, he serves as a Senior DevOps Consultant, ALM Director, and Solutions Architect at AgileThought.


In today’s episode, Dan and Eric are discussing organization transformation. If you haven’t already heard Agile Coaches’ Corner ep. 59, “The Four C’s of Organizational Culture,” you should tune into that first, as this episode makes reference to it. Today’s episode, however, is asking the question of whether an organization should start by implementing a practices-based change or a culture change when they’re looking to transform.


Is starting with changing the culture a more practical approach, or, is keeping the culture as it is and incorporating more Agile practices overtime more beneficial? Tune in to hear Dan and Eric’s take!


Key Takeaways

A culture change approach vs. a practices-based approach:

A practices-based approach generally refers to making small changes to behavior

A culture change is much more of a big bang whereas a practices-based approach is more of an Agile journey

A culture change is more of a plan-driven, A-B transformation and a practice approach is more an incremental, step-by-step process

The argument for taking a practices-based approach to transforming an organization rather than changing the culture first:

The ability to change practices and shift the overall mindset without changing the culture is a more achievable place to start — it’s also more of an Agile mindset/method (because you’re starting with a practice, seeing how it helps, measuring it, and then moving forward)

Practices get modified over time so it can be beneficial to be more Agile as your organization is going through a transformation (rather than going for that “big bang” that a culture change would call for)

Putting practices into play (such as test-driven development, breaking down product backlog items, or implementing more Kanban metrics) can help the organization discover what fits and what doesn’t fit into the current culture and also what delivers the most value to the customers

Using metrics and practices will lead to changes in thinking around how the organization is delivering


Mentioned in this Episode:

Eric Landes (LinkedIn)

Agile Coaches’ Corner Ep. 59: “The Four C’s of Organizational Culture”

The Reengineering Alternative: A Plan for Making Your Current Culture Work,
by William Schneider

Professional Scrum with Kanban Certification


Eric Landes’ Book Picks:

Training from the Back of the Room! by Sharon L. Bowman

The Color of Compromise: The Truth about the American Church’s Complicity in Racism,
by Jemar Tisby


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